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Map of the Month Club - Discussion 1
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:23 pm
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Just for info, we so far have 4 maps for the October MMC (including mine). I'm working on mine still, but I'll have it finished in time. I'll be waiting anxiously for the next exe as there's a feature my level relies on to work as I hope it will Smile

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:29 pm
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AReyeP wrote:
Just for info, we so far have 4 maps for the October MMC (including mine). I'm working on mine still, but I'll have it finished in time. I'll be waiting anxiously for the next exe as there's a feature my level relies on to work as I hope it will Smile
I'll send my map to you, once all the bugs have been sorted out, that way I'll be able to test it before I release it to you...

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:54 pm
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@ Greg, I found why those remote pushwall locations block enemies at some times but not at others - the player can activate the remote pushwall, but the location the wall had resided at before moving will continue to block the enemy unless the player is in or enters an area with the same floor code as the remote pushwall is in.

Hehe ... now with a little bit of design modification my idea for one part of this month's level works Smile I like it when new features accomodate a map designers deviousness Smile

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:56 pm
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Haasboy wrote:
AReyeP wrote:
Just for info, we so far have 4 maps for the October MMC (including mine). I'm working on mine still, but I'll have it finished in time. I'll be waiting anxiously for the next exe as there's a feature my level relies on to work as I hope it will Smile
I'll send my map to you, once all the bugs have been sorted out, that way I'll be able to test it before I release it to you...

Thanks for that Ryan - I think a few of us will be holding back until we can test our levels properly with the newest exe.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:30 pm
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AReyeP wrote:
Just for info, we so far have 4 maps for the October MMC (including mine). I'm working on mine still, but I'll have it finished in time. I'll be waiting anxiously for the next exe as there's a feature my level relies on to work as I hope it will Smile


I'm still working on my map for this month. I have not worked on it in the last week due to other priorities that unfortunately had taken all of my free time. But it's a new week and plenty of free time to work on some maps.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 5:11 pm
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Every time I think about starting I see another bug posted on this thread. I would like to do one but I guess maybe I'm concerned it won't come out as I'd like it too if there's still problems with the EXE. maybe this is holding others back from entering this montha s well?

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:53 pm
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Does anyone know how to set up the map so that the floor isn't ... red? I got that on the sample map that AReyeP submitted, and I've had no luck changing the floor to a different color. Any suggestions? Confused
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:48 am
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@ Dean: Go for it... Make the map... the problems enemies being blocked has been completely repaired. and that was the only major bug that was a real problem.. The others are mostly cosmetic.. and don't affect gameplay.

@ Steve and Everyone:

The Static sprites changing sometimes should be fixed... if it still does this Steve.. turn on the FastMonitor option and see if that removes the problem. I have a feeling that as the machines get faster, the problem rears it's head. Turning on the FastMonitor forces the machine to slow down and wait for the screen draws to sync with the program and should stop any problems. On my PII-400 Mhz machine, I don't get any problems, but I have added some code changes to try and make sure that it doesn't happen in faster machines.

The Door sound problem was a Bad IF statement. I forgot to have it check to make sure the door being opened was on the same floor area that the player was on... so you were hearing all doors open and close. This is now fixed.

The blocking of enemies by enemies being killed is now a thing of the past. Again, it was a simple if statement placement. In this case it needed to be one line lower than where it was... it needed to check the other item first... So that problem is solved. It should solve all of the blocking problems... even with bosses.

The problem with Pushable Items is fixed.. I changed the code slightly to match and use actorat values completely, rather than a combination of the tilemap (wall tiles) and actorat. It reduces the code required and also stopped the other problems you mentioned. I tested it in vertical and horizontal hallways of just 1 space wide and there was no problem. I did add a condintion thought that you can not make the Death Artifact pushable... But you can push a pushable item on the death artifact to protect yourself from being killed by touching it. You can also push the item off of it to make it active again.. Smile Tested and works 100%. Also... BJ will always grunt when you push a pushable item unless there is another sound playing with a higher priority (which is most sounds)... This is so that you won't miss hearing a door open behind you... or a shot at you from any direction..

Pushwalls can't be pushed onto any dead enemies - no matter what. They aren't static sprites but rather enemies and as such block static sprites from being pushed into them. So you will have to watch that if you use or allow the player to use a pushable item for a blocking item, that they don't kill anything in the spots within 2 tiles of a door or there is no way to push the tile out of the way and the door becomes useless.. So this is a strategy thing that players will have to remember when playing any levels.
I also modified the code slightly so that when either the player or and enemy is in the path of a moving pushwall they are killed by it. So it mush be an active enemy.. and the enemy will be killed and the pushwall will continue. Also when fixing the problem with dead enemies killed blocking active enemies I figured out how to solve the problem with enemies walking on or past spaces the pushwall has moved through... I used the same routine I created to reset the floor code under a pushable item to assign the floorcode to where a pushwall moved from. This means that pushwall rooms should have the same floor code as the room they are pushed in... (even switch activated pushwalls). This was a bug from the original code because it assumed that only the player actually pushin on the wall would make them start movement.

The problem you had with or thougth about enemies being easier to kill is just imagination... all I did was take the damage that the enemy would have been hit by and make it a percentage of your shot accuracy... So lets say you hit a player with a 100 damage points... and shot accuracy is at 80% then the damage is only 80 points.. So as your shot accuracy becomes worse the amount of damage you do to any player should be less - thus making it actually harder to kill them... But if you have been used to playing of difficulty 4 and move to 3... yes the bosses have drastic differences in their strength... All the values used for the enemy hitpoints are original game spec and haven't been changed at all... So watch your wasting of shots. meaning, don't just fire all over the place at nothing.. And even when shooting at an enemy if you are less than 4 tiles from the enemy, you will hit it... if you are more than 4 there is a possible miss in 1 of 3 shots taken just as in the original game. The only other thing I changed from the original code is that if you are more than 6 tiles away from the enemy, you do less damage as the distance increases..

The Death Artifact is programed directly like the on in SR. I have also added the code to make sure that you can't make the artifact itself pushable... Each artifact has the same random chance as it did on SR as to how many things it can kill before it becomes useless and disappears... but again, this is random totally... so this time it might kill 2 enemies and the next it might kill 3 before it cancels itself out.

Master Key Floating - Forgot to turn it on... a simple missed #define in the version.h file... it was enabled and would open all doors, but i used a second marker for floating items and I just forgot to enable the one for the Master Key... done.. fixed... works...

I couldn't replicate the dog problem that you mentioned... so it was probably just a glitch. Hopefully it was just a one time deal. I checked all the code and the code is correct, so I don't know what caused it happening the one time.

The weapon bobble thing is now fixed when going from level to level. If it was on on one level and you moved to the next level where that map maker turned of the bobble completely, it didn't reset the location variables... simple if statement fix.

So basically, all things have been fixed. I am going to test them all again tomorrow and also do a few more tests with the Pacman ghosts to see if the errorr crops up like it did in the one map by ronwolf.... Again, this just might have been a fluke and a problem with the saved games when saving/loading, which I know I fixed completely in this exe a few versions ago... Smile

So... unless there are any other things... I think this should take care of it and be 100% usable... although, again, as per my statement about machine speed, you may still see the odd graphic mistake, but it doesn't affect the game play at all.

Look for the upload later tonight - my time.. so about 16 hours of more from the time of this post...

Greg
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:01 pm
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Ok... Here we go again...

If checked and tested all the logic... Everything is fine. If you see graphic changes - save your game and send it to me at that spot. When the game loads a saved game it sets everything to the same values you were experiencing the problem with... so I can or should be experiencing the same problem.. Smile

Click Here to Download the latest - WolfMMC6

This should remove all of the problems... listed to date.. including PacMan Ghost problem and everything listed in the last few posts. So there is no problem with the October map submissions... So everyone can use the functions they want, the enemies, everything..




Beer Let the Games Continue! Beer




And Good Luck to all that compete this month...

Greg
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PS: I will be creating a specific thread/post that will be a Read-Only... This will hold the information for anyone wanting to participate in the process. It will have things all nicely placed in 1 post so that you don't have to search through this page and that page of all the threads to find things... So when we update like this post, it will say please go to this new page and download...

PPS: Steve... Can you swap the Titlepage and the Idpage graphics. That way during the demo mode, it will show the Wolfenstein Map of the Month Club graphic during the demo - for the next release... or do you want me to do it?

Greg
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:41 pm
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Will we use this EXE also for next month or will there be another one for next month? If we will use this EXE for next month, I can already start mapping. Smile
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:07 pm
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That's up to Arielus....

He won the last one so he gets to co-ordinate for November...

For maps made in October for the November release and vote... those go to Steve (AReyeP)... and will be using this EXE.

For maps made in November for the December 1st release... those will go to Arielus and it's up to him to let us know what he wants to use...

Greg
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 4:45 am
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BrotherTank wrote:
PPS: Steve... Can you swap the Titlepage and the Idpage graphics. That way during the demo mode, it will show the Wolfenstein Map of the Month Club graphic during the demo - for the next release... or do you want me to do it?
Greg

I think I know what you mean, but would I be able to ask you to do it in case I don't? Smile
Btw, thanks for all the work you've put into the exe Greg. I haven't had the chance to try it out yet being things have been extremely busy my end the past couple of days, but I'm looking forward to giving it a go tonight after work Smile

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 9:49 am
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Not a problem Steve...

I'll flip the graphics and update the package.... And no problem on fixing things. It's one of those things that you have to do when it's needed pronto. I think I got everything this time. I even fixed a bug in the original game with the pacman ghosts... lol.. originally they would be 4 seperate ghosts, but once they saw you they would become 1... I modified the code to make sure that they all stay there own individual ghosts when they go into chase mode...

Anyhow... Test it out and let me know..

Greg
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:07 pm
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Fantastic work thanks Greg!!! I've tested out the new exe and things are looking sweet Smile I was happily pushing an object all over the place without restrictions, there were no strange animations with dropped ammo clips, the ghosts (Pacmen) did indeed act individually and didn't crash the game, the master key floats like the others, and no bodies blocked movement! All's looking great gameplay wise.

After some exhaustive testing I did notice only a couple of very minor things. When General Fatface dies he still shows one frame of Schabbs, and the fake or ghost Hitlers still show a temporary "freeze" as they die (where they appear half collapsed for a second before collapsing completely). But this was all - these are just aesthetic things and don't effect gameplay.

All I can say is that everyone can work with total confidence using all the new features. Make sure to test your maps too as it's easy to make a mistake given all we now have to play with (eg: make sure a boss drops the right colour key, that health items etc give the right amount of health as you intend etc).

Lookin' Good!

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 6:10 pm
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Hey guys. I'm having problems setting up a pushwall triggered by a switch. I placed a switch on the map and placed "360 - SwPwall 1 N" on top of the switch tile. I placed the very same object tile over the wall I want to actually move north. Is this the correct way to set up a pushwall triggered by a switch? If so, it's not working for me.

EDIT:
Okay, so I'm a total moron. I didn't notice there were two sets for each switch you set up in a level. Sorry about that.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 8:47 pm
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My map for the upcoming month - I have two in "production" and haven't touched either in the past few days. Sad I'll see about completing one of them before the deadline.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 12:14 am
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Thanks for that Steve...

Hopefully I'll also have time to finish a map of mine as well... Oh... and how was that last Beta of MMC-MapEdit working?? It's funny switching between programming in C and then moving over to Pascal for the Mapedit and then back for the game.... Anyhow.. I've almost got the rubber band drawing in place and I've made a few more little changes on this end... With that in place, Cut and Paste will be easy. So I'll get that out to you as well... I just managed to get it to allow 500 wall definition lines in the mapdata file and 800 lines in the objdata file... and I've expanded the graphics that the thing has for drawing the map... It adds 20 new graphic tiles that you can use when creating the data files.. and it really makes the map look much better. The overall screen draw slows down a bit when you switch maps or play with the CTRL-Mouse buttons... but on the faster machines it shouldn't be a problem. It's like it's one step away from being like WDC where you could essentially create your own graphic for each and every item in the mapdata & objdata files... Cool I'll put the defines and eveything in a zip file when I pack it up and send it...



@ALL:

I've got one more release of the EXE in a day or two... It fixes something that everyone will love... Smile
I was going back over the Save Memory and Bug Fix threads... lol.. and Adam said something in a post that got me wondering... A simple switch of the way that it sets up the game level fixes the Invisible Door problem when you place a deaf guard tile on one side of a door.. I've already checked and tested that and it works just fine.

So now you can definitely hide ANY enemy right on the other side of a door!!!

There were a couple of other small things that I adjusted as well... and hopefully that will get rid of those two problems that you found... I know they are cosmetic, but it bugs the hell out of me... lol...

Greg
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@Dean: I'm in a re-write mode of that thing we talked about. I can't find a divide by zero anywhere...
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 6:41 pm
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Am I doing something wrong in the map layout? I opened up a room with three SS - all of whom were over four squares away from the player - and shot them all down in one second ... on Death Incarnate. The other enemies appear to have their normal endurance. Anyone else getting something like this?
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 11:53 am
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Tricob wrote:
Am I doing something wrong in the map layout? I opened up a room with three SS - all of whom were over four squares away from the player - and shot them all down in one second ... on Death Incarnate. The other enemies appear to have their normal endurance. Anyone else getting something like this?

I asked this question of Greg as I thought some of the enemies were easier to kill, but they still have the same hit points. However after you raise this I wonder if the accuracy feature when you start a level affects this kind of thing? I noticed in one level I was testing that I fired my pistol at some guards who were some distance off (around about 20 tiles at least away) and was able to kill each of them with one shot.

By the way - Greg, there's a voting poll in the fixed forum but I can't seem to cast a vote - would this be because it's locked? I know I want to vote the first option (that the MMC is a fantastic idea Smile )

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 1:55 pm
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AReyeP wrote:
Tricob wrote:
Am I doing something wrong in the map layout? I opened up a room with three SS - all of whom were over four squares away from the player - and shot them all down in one second ... on Death Incarnate. The other enemies appear to have their normal endurance. Anyone else getting something like this?

I asked this question of Greg as I thought some of the enemies were easier to kill, but they still have the same hit points. However after you raise this I wonder if the accuracy feature when you start a level affects this kind of thing? I noticed in one level I was testing that I fired my pistol at some guards who were some distance off (around about 20 tiles at least away) and was able to kill each of them with one shot.

By the way - Greg, there's a voting poll in the fixed forum but I can't seem to cast a vote - would this be because it's locked? I know I want to vote the first option (that the MMC is a fantastic idea Smile )


It probably is the fact that I locked that thread... I'll move the poll later to the first page of this thread...

On the problem with killing enemies being too easy... I'll go through the code once again and see what I can find. I've looked at it each and every time you guys ask, but it doesn't seem to make a difference no matter how I write the equations... I'll test it with the original damage and see if anything is different...

RonWolf also sent me what looks like the define files for Chaos-Edit,... I just got them so I'll give them a test and then package it all together for a new release..

Greg
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:44 pm
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The only problem with the Chaos-Edit files is that I haven't figured out how to let the 64+-walls show in 3D-edit. Perhaps someone else knows how? Smile
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 10:51 pm
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That's actually a bug in Chaos Edit from what I can see. They haven't added that to their code. ok...
This Thread is up to 25 pages... so I am going to close this one... and start a new one Called "Map of the Month Discussion 2" and I'll move the poll into the top of it.

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