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ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Ripper
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PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2004 4:05 pm
   Subject: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Greetings Mr Green

The second and first public beta phase of ChaosEdit has started today!
So please have a look at it, play around with it, find many, but not too many bugs, and send us a big load of suggestions ;D

http://www.chaos-software.org

Any questions concerning CE will be answered here, so feel free to post your thoughts about it or mail us if you like it more personal Wink

Have fun testing (but be careful! REMEMBER USING BACKUPS!!!!!)
Ripper
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PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2004 7:37 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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we wait for your feedback Wink

Andi

www.chaos-software.org
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PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2004 10:33 pm
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Very cool new version. That jukebox feature rocks (is that a strange way to start off this message?). I just plugged in a few random Audiots from games like Sensenmann and The Golden Episodes and kept them playing in the background while exploring their notes and 3DEdit. TGE shows all 321 chunks as music, instead of just the last 60 or so; wonder if that means there'll be an adlib sound effects editor too? lol. I was happily surprised to see some of those 3d-edit features, like being able to pick objects/walls from a sheet of pictures and throw them into the level with that red floor cursor; and the "scrolling 2d overhead map" at the bottom is great fun, and nice because it gives you both perceptions at the same time.

Playing around with those colour pallette choices was interesting. Some of them actually look pretty cool with Wolf3d graphics in 3d-edit (the Corridor 7 one is crazy). The scrollbar for the Tile8 pictures doesn't seem to budge, but that's not a problem - since you can just click on the individual icons at the top anyways. I like it how it's so easy to edit the walls and sprites in ChaosEdit, you can just draw them right onto the screen instead of having to open other programs and upload them from a darned BMP - lol. Showing the amount of bytes that each picture takes for sprites/vgagraph stuff is a nice touch, and being able to add and delete graphics from the list is VERY helpful. Man, you wouldn't believe how much trouble I had to go through to delete a few little pictures from the VSWAP and VGAGRAPH when there was only Floedit! Laughing

Having those "Turning points" for the guards in 3d-mode is awesome; since it's pretty vital to the placement of the enemies (and fun to follow in their path for no reason! lol). The BJ icons for different skill levels don't seem to show all the guards from different difficulties yet (just for 'Can I Play Daddy' - nomatter which icon you click on), but it's definately a cool idea. One thing I really enjoyed about Adam's WDC is that it could check for errors in your level, like "No Start Position" and "Guard hit a wall at x,y" for you; and how the program could change the 64x64 mapsize (even though people haven't actually put that idea to use yet). Have you guys ever considered adding stuff like that in Chaosedit?

Sorry if I'm not really pointing out bugs, just having some fun with your program right now! Yay, Change the World (14/27) is playing in your jukebox again... *starts singing along and runs off to goof around in ChaosEdit some more* Mr Green
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PostPosted: Wed May 19, 2004 1:58 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Thanks for the nice comment containing many precious suggestions Wink
Also a few bugs are named, so there's really no need to apologize Mr Green If if you had just told us what you were playing around with and how you felt doing this, it would've been a very interesting post for us! Cause we want to know what everybody things of it and what we gotta do, to make everybody love it Mr Green

To your content:
Music: Hmmm, seems like the check whether a chunk is a song or something else doesn't work yet, but I wonder if those adlib sounds couldn't be used the same way as the music stuff...
3D-Edit features: As you can see, making suggestions works Mr Green Yesterday I had to remove a bug about being able to remove objects on the other side of the level through the right border ;D
Tile8s: OOPS, we forgot to remove the scrollbar, which really isn't used currently Wink But we'd also like to show some kind of messagebox preview for that box.
Adding/Deleting stuff: Was it really that ackward with FloEdit? I only cursed Flo a few times when trying to add some new sprites *gg*
Automatic error checking: Yes, we already thought a bit about it, and I also wanted to have the sprites checked for too huge pictures and warn when the outer edges are filled without using DarkOne's patch, but we didn't think about it more deeply yet Wink

Again, thanks for your comment ;D
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PostPosted: Wed May 19, 2004 4:42 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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*g*so it makes fun to write a leveleditor Wink

yesterday i have very shortly thinked about bigger maps . It shouldnīt be a problem to write a bigger level to the gamemaps but i dont know how we must change the leveleditor that is only maked for 64x64 to edit bigger levels . i have the idea to split a level in the editor(and only there , not in the file) in 4 normal levels , but i think thats not so good . scrollbars are possible but the scrolling should be slow and making it fast is very tricky...

but if we make bigger levels why we donīt make bigger sprites or walls with a better resolution ? i think it hangs on the problem that it gives in the moment no tc that can use that . but to get a tc that can use it we need a leveleditor that can edit it....

thats the problem , but if anyone want write a tc we want try to help with a matching leveleditor Wink

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PostPosted: Wed May 19, 2004 1:09 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Shocked This is cool software, Ripper Exclamation it is almost same as FloEdit does... At first time I don't understand the langauge when I tried to unzip those files into folder, but I got lucky and now understand those langauge after I open ChaosEdit..Just look around those features and not test them yet.. Wink
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2004 12:33 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Some bugs! First: On my machine, the whole window is too big and gets the bottom cut off! And the scroll bars don't work; rather, they crash the program.
Second: The sounds don't seem to save. Though I'm not sure whether this is a bug or just something else.

I really like the editor though. Especially the 3d-edit mode, that's very cool for testing the look of the maps. I have to admit though that I'm not a big fan of the Floedit way you it - personally I like all the map symbols to be on the same page as the map, so there's no flicking between them. But it has a lot of potential, especially with things like auto-converting sound to Wolfenstein 3d format.
The music editor will be cool when the music can actually be edited...

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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2004 2:59 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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We didn't have an selfextracting programm producer in English at hand, when we released it Mr Green
But we thought it should be possible to get through it Wink
We'll try to release it with an English extractor next time.

@Hair Machine: Please actually read the stuff listed on our beta page, as it describes already known problems to leave data loss on a minimum, if you i.e. create a huge new sound set and want to save then, but sound saving isn't added yet... Embarassed

Although we didn't get ChaosEdit to crash using the main window scrollbars, we knew that they won't work... But crashing is really not that nice...

The programm is designed, so that there won't be anything important cutted when displaying at 800x600 although it's still HIGHLY recommend to have at least 1024x768.
We don't like that flipping, too, so we added several ways to avoid it:
I know, it's not documented in any way, as everything else isn't documented, too, but there's a map button in the toolbar above the map in MapEdit (it says "Open Symbolbox" if you hold the mousebutton above it). If you click on this button, you'll have three choices: vertical and horizontal for hardcore editors who already know what each symbol means, to give them the whole set in a small window (could be a bit smaller perhaps Mr Green), and one mapedit like symbol list, where you can choose, which stuff you'd like to see in the list and scroll up and down and such. Also you can resize the list as you wish, so this list is quite useful, but I don't know how useful it can be at 800x600.
Then there's another method: if you also loaded textures and/or sprites, you can go to 3DEdit and press "Select Texture" and/or "Select Object" to get a set of wall and sprite images you can choose. This can also be used for the MapEdit page, so you can see directly which wall you're going to set, and not only a strange symbol and a not-much-saying name for it Wink

Hope that makes some things clearer, and revealed some other nice features of CE Wink
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2004 5:09 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Ripper wrote:
The programm is designed, so that there won't be anything important cutted when displaying at 800x600 although it's still HIGHLY recommend to have at least 1024x768.


It is not good idea to using that size if you have 15" monitor which it only support the size upto
800x600 depends on kind of brand what you have. if you want to using this 1024x768, then it is highest recommand to have a least 17" and above monitor to view this size better..

Very few wolfers still have 15" monitors....So you would have include size autodetect in that ChaosEdit software... Mr Green Cheesy Grin
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2004 5:21 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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how do I download it?! I cant find a downloading spot anywhere, except for the downloads section, but that doesnt have a download for it...
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2004 6:42 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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http://www.chaos-software.org/betas/CEBeta2v0_5.exe

Glad to be of service but you should really explore. There is a link to the CE 2 Beta on the main chaos-software page.
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2004 10:23 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Hello... Looks good. I've just been playing around with it some, nothing too involved.

I like the graphics editor. That's something WDC desperately needs sometime.
I really like that it shows the compressed size. That's a great idea! *prepares to borrow the idea for WDC* Wink
The music viewer is nice. I wish that there was a way to see all tracks at once, but I know that that would make the screen very busy.

Some (all?) map viewing settings don't save when I reload the program (Grid, ProfMode, etc).

About exporting maps: You seem to have made your own MAP file format. The 3rd plane is not exported to this file. Also, there's no file header for easy recognition.

Selecting Death incarnate mode for 3DEdit makes my some of my guards disappear.
-ex: E1M1 (Wolf3D) - go out the first door and take a right. The guard on your left (39,61) appears only when I click the center level button. The guard on the right (28, 62) never appears.
The position doesn't update anymore while your in 3DEdit... maybe it could show where you're pointing.

In customize, if I click BC or BS I get some errors (not big though). "Can't load Lists.txt" and "Can't load SprInfo.txt"

What is "RipPalette"? I only get "ERROR" when I click it.

I like to watch the arrow move around in the bottom while in 3DEdit Smile
The Locked Doors/Pushwalls checkboxes don't seem to do anything...

If you want an installer that can do multiple languages, you might try NSIS (what I use). The latest version has several compression techniques.

Some stuff I noticed for CE-WDC compatibility. You import font chatacters with BMP... FloEdit and WDC use WSF files. Your palette files are straight RGB data and not JASC pal files (no big deal there, I can change WDC to use your palette file types).

Sorry that this stuff seems very insignificant. I'm just thinking how to make our two programs easily compatible with each other. That way a group can use whichever program (or even FloEdit) and be able to easily share exported files, etc, with each other.

All-in-all, very nice looking!

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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2004 2:20 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Andi?? HELP!! *gg*

We're going to add better support for 800x600 (as I used this resolution myself when the project was young), perhaps we can even find a easy solution, so it doesn't take too much time Wink

Please don't link to the file directly, as the beta page contains IMPORTANT informations. The link to the beta page can either be found on the main page, as ZuljinRaynor said, or on the ChaosEdit project page or here: http://www.chaos-software.org/cebeta2page.html (Andi already asked me to set up a better link to the beta page, but I didn't have time yet Mr Green)

Yeah, especially for the sprites being able to see the compressed size is essential, cause then you can still change it to get it below 4097 instead of getting stupid error messages telling you, that the sprite is too large... Also there you can see the differences between the normal sprite saving mode and Andi's compressed version, which tries to reuse data from earlier in the same sprite, so for example a complete red filled sprite would take up 4740 bytes which isn't possible because it's more than 4096 bytes... With sprite compression enabled it's only 708 bytes!! Of course this is the ideal case for this algorithm, but symmetric sprites can also take a big advantage of this feature Wink

Hmm, I think I'll try to allow showing all tracks at once using multiple colors...

I told Andi to save more settings in the INI-file but I think it got a bit lost in the latest chaos ;D

As said in the todo list, the 3rd-plane is still missing large portions of support, although they're already correctly saved (used it for the upper wall layer quite some time ago, perhaps some remember the discussions about those screenshots being real or fake Mr Green).

We didn't think much about compatibility yet, but of course we're going to make things as compatible as possible, to make it easy for users to switch between the programms all the time, as you said, as every programm has it's own advantages and disadvantages Wink

Hmm, but your problem in 3dEdit is VERY strange. For me it really works flawlessly! In easy it doesn't show a guard at the place you mentioned, in hurt me plenty only the one at (39, 61) and in death incarnate both (39, 61) and (28, 62)! Really strange... I'll have to have a look at it...
What do you mean by "the position doesn't update anymore while you're in 3DEdit"? Which position? AHH!! I got it! Very good idea! Thanks ;D

Those customize error messages come from the fact, that these files don't exist for those games yet. They still need to be created.

*lol* I don't know exactly what this button does either, but I >guess<, it can rip the palette of a wolf screenshot in the copy&paste buffer. I told Andi to document that button a bit better, but nothing seems to have happened there yet Wink

Those "lock" buttons perhaps should get another name... (Andi didn't understand what I meant with them at first, too) Those buttons lock doors or pushwalls for editing, so if you want to texture a whole room with another texture you don't have to worry about doors being deleted.

We don't want to have an installer, just an selfunpacker. ChaosEdit shall only need its folder and nothing else Wink So an installer isn't really needed.

About that font export files... what the hell is a WSF file?!? I never heard of that! Mr Green
But using palette formats from professional graphic programms really makes sense, as I guess, most graphics will be created with such and so the palette should be imported from those, too ;D

Thanks for the comments ;D
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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2004 5:33 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Hey

I was just wondering if you could add a button which could save all loaded files, as a project, even if some weren't loaded...

For example project1.prj could load all but music if you wanted it to... You see what I mean

Maybe you could post a note on the 3D edit page too saying, you must load the sprites, maps and walls before you can use 3dEdit??

Plus what does the 3rd Plane do? Is it something to do with ceilings and floors? Well when I was switching to and from it, it crashed out...

- James (old member as jamez)
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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2004 8:46 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Load all and save all buttons are on our todo list, but as I understood it, Andi doesn't want real project files... Perhaps a topic valueable to discuss with him Wink

Good idea with the note at 3dEdit claiming missing parts!

?? Why did the 3rd plane button crash the programm? We need more details especially the address, where the crash happened, to be able to investigate there!
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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2004 10:43 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Ripper wrote:
About that font export files... what the hell is a WSF file?!? I never heard of that! Mr Green

It's the export format that Flo made. It's almost exactly the same format as fonts are stored in the VGAGRAPH chunk. The only difference is that the offset section is removed (which sucks). If I had made it, I would've left the offset section in for simplicity, but the offsets can be re-calculated from the font width and height. Another thing... your font list seems to show only the used characters. 256 characters are in the font chunk, but a lot have a width of 0.

Quote:
Maybe you could post a note on the 3D edit page too saying, you must load the sprites, maps and walls before you can use 3dEdit??

This confused me at first, too. It was completely black. I took a guess that I had to load them, too.

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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2004 2:28 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Adam Biser wrote:


Some (all?) map viewing settings don't save when I reload the program (Grid, ProfMode, etc).

About exporting maps: You seem to have made your own MAP file format. The 3rd plane is not exported to this file. Also, there's no file header for easy recognition.



Yes i know but that i planed in next versions , ChaosEdit has get only one day before the beta was released a function to save settings , so its very incomplete .

We save the maps in hex , without any compression or header , so i think its simpler to use in other applications that from foreign people or simple with a hexeditor for other use, but if you give me a little description of your format , i would like to use it too in chaosedit .

Yes in the export-function the third plane is yet not integrated , but i think that comes with the second export-format .


Adam Biser wrote:


What is "RipPalette"? I only get "ERROR" when I click it.



RipPalette is to rip a palette from a dos-game . In wolf and other games from this engine is the palette often linked in the exe , so we must find another way to get it .
To get a palette from any Dos-Game(not only Wolfenstein-engine) you start it in windows , make a screenshot with the "print screen" key and then change to windows and klick the RipPalette-button Wink
Now you can save the palette or do what you want...


Adam Biser wrote:

Some stuff I noticed for CE-WDC compatibility. You import font chatacters with BMP... FloEdit and WDC use WSF files. Your palette files are straight RGB data and not JASC pal files (no big deal there, I can change WDC to use your palette file types).

Sorry that this stuff seems very insignificant. I'm just thinking how to make our two programs easily compatible with each other. That way a group can use whichever program (or even FloEdit) and be able to easily share exported files, etc, with each other.

All-in-all, very nice looking!


yes you have right , we dont are microsoft , i think too we should be as compatible as possible . Can you send us infos over your formats so we can integrate it more quickly....
I think we use than both formats , our and yours . If you want any information over our simple formats write us...

thanks Smile


Quote:

Hey

I was just wondering if you could add a button which could save all loaded files, as a project, even if some weren't loaded...

For example project1.prj could load all but music if you wanted it to... You see what I mean

Plus what does the 3rd Plane do? Is it something to do with ceilings and floors? Well when I was switching to and from it, it crashed out...

- James (old member as jamez)



Like ripper it said we plan a button that load all files from one directory like floedit .
I dont se any sense in a project-file that says "load sounds from there , musik from there , maps from there and textures from there" . Wolf needs all files in the same directory so i think its make a big confusion if the files are scattered on the complete harddisk .

Yes, you're right, the 3rd plane is supposed to be used for ceiling and floor textures, but it's open to use with whatever you want .


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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2004 4:44 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Jamez again...

I guess that the 3rd Plane is to be used for something you've coded in?

Well I was flicking the tick box on and off and it bombed out... I don't think it had anything to do with CE probably just my shite computer...

I was also thinking of a idea for a ReadMe (****art.wl6) editor whereby The screen is tiled (so one half is in the top half and thers another screen in the bottom half...

And if you've loaded the VGA files, as you write your readme it could be previewed underneath with maybe a refresh or for people with faster computers, an AutoRefresh tick box... What do you think?

If your confused with my idea, i'll draw out an imaginary screenshot of what it might look like...

Oh and is there a way of removing or keeping the frame on the map editor? So you could have it without the black lines or with them? If there isn't - i think it's a good idea too Mr Green And are there any shortcuts in CE and are you going to be adding a bar at the top of the page w/ stuff like [File Edit View Window Exit Etc]??

I'll keep testing Smile

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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2004 11:23 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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jamez wrote:
Jamez again...

I guess that the 3rd Plane is to be used for something you've coded in?


Well I was flicking the tick box on and off and it bombed out... I don't think it had anything to do with CE probably just my shite computer...


yes we used it for a new engine...

hmm...okay it can be your computer, but try to reproduce it and if you can please write details...

jamez wrote:

Oh and is there a way of removing or keeping the frame on the map editor? So you could have it without the black lines or with them? If there isn't - i think it's a good idea too Mr Green And are there any shortcuts in CE and are you going to be adding a bar at the top of the page w/ stuff like [File Edit View Window Exit Etc]??

I'll keep testing Smile



you mean the frame around the mapsymbols ? try to uncheck the "Grid"-Checkbox...
if you mean another thing pease write again , my english is not the best...

hm..shortcuts...why not , but that can take time before we integrate it .
No we dont want use a menu in CE cause we have yet problems to get the window on a 800x600 screen , i think a menu is waste of place case all functions can accessed over the toolbars .


okay , have fun Wink
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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2004 2:09 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Sorry i didn't see the grid check box...

Is there a way to edit the map symbols as when I use 3D edit, some of the objects don't match with the graphics in the Editor...

Also what did you think about my idea of the readme editor?

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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2004 2:38 pm
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Thank you! Thank you! Choas Edit fixed my Tile8's!! Thanks you Andi, Ripper and all of Chaos Software! Yes! Very Happy

Oh and BTW, it rocks, I really love the palette wit hthe editor, makes stuff so easy now! I will use 3D Edit when it displays the correct sprite Razz

Also, how do you save the symbols?

Thanks for a great editor! Mr Green Geek

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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 6:24 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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jamez wrote:
Sorry i didn't see the grid check box...

Is there a way to edit the map symbols as when I use 3D edit, some of the objects don't match with the graphics in the Editor...

Also what did you think about my idea of the readme editor?



no problem , we must write a help-file in the future that describes all the features Wink
try it in customize->symbols , there is a symboleditor . It can edit the symbols , itīs a little bit complex cause itīs not a standart editor like paint .
You use it so:

Click with left on a symbol , now in both upper windows you see this symbol , in the left of this windows can you edit it , in the right you can take colors like with the pipette , if you need a color that is not in the symbol you edit then you click with the rigth mouse-button on the symbollist on a symbol that has it or you use the rgb-value....

if you edited your symbol you click with rigth in the symbollist there where you want have it and click "use Symbol"

Itīs first complex but i think if you use it often its very simple.....

the problem is , that we have forgotten to implement a save-button*g*Wink
but no big problem , you can make a screenshot , cut it out the window and save it in the mapobject-folder under the game you want edit as symbols.bmp.....

the readme-editor is a good idea , but its better when you discuss this with ripper , he knows more about the graphics .


KyleRTCW wrote:

Thank you! Thank you! Choas Edit fixed my Tile8's!! Thanks you Andi, Ripper and all of Chaos Software! Yes!

Oh and BTW, it rocks, I really love the palette wit hthe editor, makes stuff so easy now! I will use 3D Edit when it displays the correct sprite

Also, how do you save the symbols?

Thanks for a great editor!



Smile Smile

we have forget a save-function for the symbols , but look in the mapobject-folder , in every subfolder it gives a file that names symbols.bmp , that you can edit with paint or another editor .


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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 10:31 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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I didn't mean the symbol editor, although a save button may help Mr Green

What I meant was when I'm using 3D edit, if I had a column placed somewhere, but I'd have coded in wolf for the column image to be say the first image, and where the column is on the game in 3D edit it will show something else...

It's hard to explain -- I just want to know if you're going to make it so that you can configure what images go with what so when using 3D Edit - it looks like when you're playing..

Catch ma drift? Sorry bout the bad explaining!

Andi_CS wrote:

the readme-editor is a good idea , but its better when you discuss this with ripper , he knows more about the graphics .


I will make a screenshot to look like it's in chaosedit and post it up.. u can tell me what you think then!

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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 12:47 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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jamez wrote:

What I meant was when I'm using 3D edit, if I had a column placed somewhere, but I'd have coded in wolf for the column image to be say the first image, and where the column is on the game in 3D edit it will show something else...

It's hard to explain -- I just want to know if you're going to make it so that you can configure what images go with what so when using 3D Edit - it looks like when you're playing..

Catch ma drift? Sorry bout the bad explaining!



That easy, open up sprinfo.txt,
find this block:
::: CODE :::

;Statische_Objekte(1)
23 2 1 0
24 3 1 0
25 4 1 0
26 5 1 0
27 6 1 0
28 7 1 0
29 8 1 0
30 9 1 0
31 10 1 0
32 11 1 0
33 12 1 0
34 13 1 0
35 14 1 0
36 15 1 0
37 16 1 0
38 17 1 0
39 18 1 0
40 19 1 0
41 20 1 0
42 21 1 0
43 22 1 0
44 23 1 0
45 24 1 0
46 25 1 0
47 26 1 0
48 27 1 0
49 28 1 0
50 29 1 0
51 30 1 0
52 31 1 0
53 32 1 0
54 33 1 0
55 34 1 0
56 35 1 0
57 36 1 0
58 37 1 0
59 38 1 0
60 39 1 0
61 40 1 0
62 41 1 0
63 42 1 0
64 43 1 0
65 44 1 0
66 45 1 0
67 46 1 0
68 47 1 0
69 48 1 0
70 49 1 0

now look, here is how it goes ( i figured this out)

Example : 70 49 1 0
70 = Object Case
49 = Sprite Page -1 (read below for more info)
1 = ???
0 = ???

***

49 = Sprite Page -1
Ok load your sprites up, now, I added a key after the chaingun stuff.
The last image number in the oringnal VSWAP is 436 however I added one so therefore, it's now 437. ( i think)

now my new case would be 72 (WL_GAME.C remember??)
so below after 70 or the last line in that block, I would write:
::: CODE :::

72 436 1 0

72 = case number of new static object
436 = -1 of page, (this is because Chaos Edit's First Sprite Page is 1 when it should be 0. so this messes it up) so 437 is my actual image but I -1
1 = What is this?
0 = What is this?

I hope this helps a little better.

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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 1:48 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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A real sprite list editor is still missing, but planned (though I think we forgot it in the last time Mr Green).
As KyleRTCW wrote the sprlist.txt in the appropriate directory is responsible for mapping the object numbers to actual sprites.
As the first line is supposed to suggest the format follows these rules:

;Tilenumber_Spritenumber_Typ_Direction_Difficulty (the last part was missing, but is only allowed for type 4 anyways)


The first value is the object tile number you see in the right column of chaosedit right beneath the object symbols.

The second value is the "spritenumber-1" as seen in the SpriteEdit window. In the first beta phase there was a small discussion about, because people found it confusing that they were able to see sprite "0/436" but not "436/436"... So we changed it back to begin with 1. But I guess we will do the same thing we did in GraphicsEdit and just add a line with the correct tilenumber beneath the "1/436" stuff Wink

The third value describe type of object:
- 1 = static object like vines or a key
- 2 = player start position (directional)
- 3 = non directional actors
- 4 = directional actors with additional difficulty value

The forth value is the direction of a directional object:
- 0 = east
- 1 = north
- 2 = west
- 3 = south

The fifth value can only exist for type 4 objects and describes the difficulty where this enemy can be found:
- 1 = Can I play, Daddy?
- 3 = Bring 'em on!
- 4 = I am Death incarnate!


Hope that makes it a bit clearer Wink

About the helpart editor: We're planning a wysiwyg editor for this, but that's still pointing a bit into the future Mr Green
Doesn't WDC have some helpart support?
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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 2:15 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Ripper wrote:
The forth value is the direction of a directional object:
- 0 = east
- 1 = north
- 2 = west
- 3 = south

What about diagonal directions (for turning points) or do those even matter?

Ripper wrote:
About the helpart editor: We're planning a wysiwyg editor for this, but that's still pointing a bit into the future Mr Green
Doesn't WDC have some helpart support?

Yep, it does... a WYSIWYG is something that I've thought about too, or probably just a viewer that shows what your helpart text will look like as you change it.

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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 2:33 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Ripper wrote:
About the helpart editor: We're planning a wysiwyg editor for this, but that's still pointing a bit into the future Mr Green
Doesn't WDC have some helpart support?


Thats what I meant like, you're editing it by moving images around which is automatically converted into the code, but you could open an advance button or something so you could edit the raw file...?

Also the sprite list this was what I was talking about before, i was just getting confused and annoyed when I couldn't find anything lol - i guess it is the BETA version Mr Green

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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2004 4:26 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit: Second beta phase started!
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Adam Biser wrote:
Ripper wrote:
The forth value is the direction of a directional object:
- 0 = east
- 1 = north
- 2 = west
- 3 = south

What about diagonal directions (for turning points) or do those even matter?



Itīs only to assign spritegraphics(chunks) to sprite-idīs , the direction-arrows are not in any wolfenstein-file , so we cant assign to a graphic from there so we dont need any othe rdirections .

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PostPosted: Tue May 25, 2004 1:37 am
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Hmm, but I guess it would be useful, if you'd also wanted to alter the turning points.
After all there aren't any graphics for the start points, too Mr Green

About the helpart editor: I'm thinking of an editor, where you can alter everything directly inside the helpart view, but currently I have no idea how that whole helpart stuff is working, but I didn't have a look at it anyways yet Wink
But before this thing can be started we gotta reorganize our file handling, because it is rather chaotic in the moment Embarassed
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PostPosted: Tue May 25, 2004 6:00 am
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WDC uses turning point directions to error check guard paths and make sure they are complete and don't run into anything. If you thought about doing something like that later on, having the directions would be pretty useful. Smile

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