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ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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Ripper
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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 5:08 pm
   Subject: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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Party Today (minus a few hours *cough*) was ChaosEdit's third birthday bringing you a new version! Party
We hope you like it and that it is as stable as it is on our computers Mr Green
Please post any suggestions, bug reports and flame cocktails here or send us an email!

Thanks ;D

http://www.chaos-software.de.vu
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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2005 9:44 pm
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Congratulations on the pre-release. I was just saying that you tend to disappear into some secret lab someplace and pop out every-so-often and go "hey, look at this... this is cool!" Very Happy
I hope to give it a go sometime soon (maybe nab some ideas, too, if I ever really get back to WDC bug fixes/updates Laughing).

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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 4:35 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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Great timing! I started trying out ChaosEdit last week, using it to compress my collection's mapsets, vswaps and vga files for a CD-ROM project. Does a great job! Average of 150k reduction in VSWAP size, mapsets cut in half, the vga files I get a few bytes, but every byte counts when you have hundreds of mods and patches to cram into 700MB! Geek

I've been loading the files and then saving them to accomplish the task. Is there a "batch" or command-line process available (or possible) which would make this easier? Maybe select a group of files to simply load and save automatically.

I haven't been able to get audio files to load; nothing happens when I load them, and I can't play any of the music tracks in the audiot. Am I doing something wrong?

A wish: accurate conversions of v1.0 shareware mapsets to v1.4. I hate using v1.0 because of its video instability (crashes) and would love to accurately convert, say, AReyeP's Odyssey to 1.4 for my collection. I used to do some by hand but I have gotten lazier (and busier). One of the things I remember is that a "false door" in v1.0 would convert to a "mud wall" in v1.4, which bombs in the shareware engine. So that was one I had to change by hand after using WolfMap 1.60 to convert the maps.

In any case, ChaosEdit looks to be a very easy-to-use and useful tool. And stable too! Mr Green

Keep up the great work,
Andy
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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2005 4:07 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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hi !
hehe , first i dont sure if anyone needs the compression-saving cause the big storage medias in this time and only have written it cause im faszinated from the idea to make the files littler than anyone else without changing the wolf-eingine....
im happy to see that anyone use it Smile

A commandline-tool is possible but in the moment im to lazy to write it Wink *g*

hm...do you get a errormessgae like "IMFLIB.DLL not found!" ???
Or you search on the false place ?? Audio->Music for the AUDIOT-Files... ??


Okay i think we can help you with your wish....can you describe this problems particularly ? i ever used v1.0 so i dont know this problems...

thanks for the good feedback Smile

Andi
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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2005 10:20 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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Haven't played with the audio yet, but the rest seems to be working fine... What I would like is two simple buttons... "Load All" and "Save All"... that would make it complete... (unless I missed them somewhere).

Other than that.. No bugs so far... keep up the good work... the more I use both Chaosedit and WDC the more I am leaning away from map edit and the individual programs to manipulate the files... Keep up the good work...

Greg
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PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2005 1:37 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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Andi,

Well maybe a command-line option is asking too much, but how about a button that will load and save any file type "under the covers" without actually displaying it in the editor window(s), also without prompting "do you want to replace it?" Maybe always create a .bak file for the squeamish or accident-prone button-clickers. This would be the auto-compress button.

I neglected to click on the "music" tab after selecting "audio"; that's why it didn't work! Sorry about the false alarm... Embarassed Wow! it works great! I can easily select any music in the audiot file!

As for the shareware v1.0 to v1.4 thing, all I can really say is that the MAPEDIT wall codes for certain walls changed going from v1.0 (MAPTEMP) to v1.4 (GAMEMAPS), the blue "false door" being the one I remember most vividly. Checking in MAPEDIT 7.2, this one is code 001D in v1.0 and 0032 in v1.4. I don't know if a file listing all the differences exists anywhere. And because the shareware engine only accepts a subset of the full floor codes, some can be invalid (such as v1.4's mud wall/brown weave which is 001D, and not in the shareware episode 1).

I hope I'm not being too confusing! Smile

Andy
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2005 7:13 pm
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hehe thanks , with this kind of feedback it makes fun to write software Wink

you get your Load and save all...yesterday i have begun to write on the loadall-dialog...i hope to complete this soon....

andy , i have another idea....with load and save-all buttons an with an option to disable this bugging overwrite-messages (yes , i dont love it..it was rippers idea Wink *gg* ) you can really simple compress your files...
the v1.0 / v1.4 version-converter should be too not a problem , you have it in the next release....

hehe , shit happens@audio Wink *g*
thanks , im happy that it works Smile

andi
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2005 7:21 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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oh shit one minute....you mean v1.0 not 1.1.....hmmm.....


can you try to find out the differences in the games and make a list , than i write a converter....


chaos
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2005 5:16 pm
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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BrotherTank wrote:
the more I use both Chaosedit and WDC the more I am leaning away from map edit and the individual programs to manipulate the files... Keep up the good work...

We're very happy that we can slowly take the classic's positive points to ChaosEdit to make the world for "classic users" more comfortable, too. But please tell us which things are still better in MapEdit and co than in ChaosEdit, so we can improve these things Mr Green

@Andy_Nonymous: Well, I also start to think that this "Do you want to replace it" question sucks and that a simple .bak file should be much more useful. But one problem is, that this "backup" will be useless, if you save for example first textures and then sprites, because it will overwrite the backup after the textures saving, so you won't be able to get the old version before the textures saving. OK, now it won't be possible at all, too... I think we should work this out *cough*
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2005 9:26 am
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@Ripper: I only wanted to do away with the "Do you want to replace it?" prompting for the new/added "auto-compress" function. I don't want to change what's already there, that works fine.

@Andi: I figured out the OBJDATA and MAPDATA code changes going from v1.0 to v1.4 shareware:

In both cases, codes were only added or moved going from v1.0 to v1.4.

OBJDATA:
everything valid in v1.0 exists in v1.4 with the same codes.

MAPDATA:
0000 through 001c are identical in both versions

001d through 002a (in v1.0) gets offset by 15h to 0032 through 003f (in v1.4)

0040 through end are again identical in both versions

id (or Apogee) shifted the 001d-002a items (which were mostly "odd" stuff not in the released game) to make room for the registered version items; 001d-0031 are the registered-only codes and the v1.4 shareware engine will bomb when it encounters them ("sparse page" error). Curiously, the v1.0 shareware engine is quite immune from invalid mapdata entries; they either show up as garbled images or as nothing. In fact 0018 and 001a were garbled images that became the slime walls, which were not defined in the v1.0 engine.

Death to v1.0! Long live v1.4! Mr Green

Andy
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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2005 4:30 pm
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Andi/Ripper...

I think I've found something... Download Haasboy's new DT modification and try and load the VGAGRAPH file. It errors out. WDC reads it just fine, but ChaosEdit gives a weird error (Load Chunk - Couldn't allocate memory (719336278 bytes)). Other than that, it's working fine so far...

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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2005 5:17 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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ChaosTeam,

Adding to BrotherTank's post, I found that just loading the graphics works and then you can save them without any error messages. However, then the Double Trouble game won't play! Seems the VGAGRAPH got corrupted, though it did compress more than usual. The usual change is 5 or 17 bytes; this time it was more like 138, but I think ChaosEdit bit off more than Double Troule could chew...

Loading and saving the sprites (VSWAP) works fine, though.

Andy
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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2005 9:36 am
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Yesterday I also noticed, that somethings fishy with loading DT's graphics. On my system most pictures are totally screwed up, only very few are viewable correctly.
Strange that it loads differently on different systems...
I'll have a look, thanks for the infos ;D

PS: Hmmm strange... if I load other graphics (i.e. Hidden Danger) before I load Double Trouble's then everything is shown correctly... looks like an uninitialised variable, but why does this only (?) happen with DT?

PPS: OK, it was a bug in the font recognition, which let CE think, that the third font was the first picture Embarassed


Last edited by Ripper on Mon May 30, 2005 10:49 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2005 10:44 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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Ripper wrote:
Yesterday I also noticed, that somethings fishy with loading DT's graphics. On my system most pictures are totally screwed up, only very few are viewable correctly.
Strange that it loads differently on different systems...
I'll have a look, thanks for the infos ;D

PS: Hmmm strange... if I load other graphics (i.e. Hidden Danger) before I load Double Trouble's then everything is shown correctly... looks like an uninitialised variable, but why does this only (?) happen with DT?

I also noticed this when I opened my project with Chaosedit, and also while scrolling through the screwed up pics, I was throughn out of the program.

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PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2005 10:56 am
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OK, saving also works with DT and the file is 38 bytes smaller than the original.
I think I should start having a look at a better compression for VGAGRAPH soon Mr Green
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 1:33 pm
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Ripper wrote:
I think I should start having a look at a better compression for VGAGRAPH soon Mr Green


Shocked <drooling> Cool, you're going to crunch those VGA files like you do the Gamemaps and Vswap? Do you think the Audiot file is a candidate for compression, too? Forgive me if I am getting too greedy! Very Happy

I had a thought about the "auto-compression" feature I requested. Maybe it can be disabled whenever a file is already open, to avoid any nasty backup losses like you mentioned, Ripper. "Gray out" the button when it's possible to lose a backup, or at least revive the "Do you want to replace it?" prompt for this case.

Andy
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 5:35 pm
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Quote:
>... revive the "Do you want to replace it?" prompt for this case.

Heck, have that feature added as an "option", not something hard-coded into the utility. That's what I always do when I think about putting features in that some people will want and some won't.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2005 9:15 pm
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Andy_Nonymous wrote:
Do you think the Audiot file is a candidate for compression, too?
Wolf3D's AUDIOT is not compressed. The older EGA games did have compressed AUDIOT files and the code for AUDIOT compression is still in the source.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2005 11:54 am
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Andy_Nonymous wrote:
Cool, you're going to crunch those VGA files like you do the Gamemaps and Vswap?


Well, I don't think, we'll be able to increase the compression rate THAT much, but it'll save a few thousand bytes for sure. But I can really just guess, how much my idea will save, without testing it. And I don't know if it'll be worth it, because it will need some more time... We'll see Wink

Andy_Nomymous wrote:
I had a thought about the "auto-compression" feature I requested. Maybe it can be disabled whenever a file is already open, to avoid any nasty backup losses like you mentioned, Ripper. "Gray out" the button when it's possible to lose a backup, or at least revive the "Do you want to replace it?" prompt for this case.


You mean, a save all changes before auto-compression? Yes, this will really be needed.

@Tricob: Yeah, I think maybe we'll include an option for it, with the default on show this stupid box, to be sure one knows what he's doing Wink
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 8:50 am
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I don't think its been mentioned yet. But one thing I'd really like to see in ChaosEdit is the ability to save ceiling/floor color/texture settings. It seems to reset itself after you exit the program. I really like this feature because it lets you experiment with different colors or textures to see how they'll look in the game before you go into the source and change it. Other than that though, the program is lookin' great. All you guys at Chaos Software, keep up the good work. I'm looking forward to seeing future versions of this program.
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2005 6:31 pm
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I was able to try out this utility a little bit last night. I'm not often impressed by utilities, but I have to grant this one did me just that, and I mean that in every good way. Smile

A few things I might suggest, though ...

1) Enable the utility to have everything accessible in 800x600. The window would fit in my screen fine if not for the bottom part being hacked off.
2) Settings for several Wolfenstein Mods are listed, but strangely, "Spear: Resurrection" isn't one of them. Now, I don't intend on making a SOD2 map set any time soon, but I found it a bit disappointing that this one wasn't listed. AReyeP released a construction set for this game years ago.
3) I'd like their to be a "Load all files" button so you won't have to load up graphics, then music, then maps ... you get the idea. Smile It might already be in the list of options actually, but if so, it's the bottom part of the window that's hacked off in my 800x600 screen. I'd stick with a 640x480 screen to be honest, but my Windows 95/98 version of Tetris only runs in 800x600, and I like its smooth vertical action. Cheesy Grin
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 5:59 am
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...the mainly advantage on the compression of the vga-files is , that you can then use background-grafics like in SOD in any color without to change your palette....your pics can be bigger and use the colors that you want without you must look on the size...
if you meanly use not the wolf-colors (red/grey/black etc) with the compression-rate is bigger than now...

to use the compression-routines for audiot-files that are used in older games is not so good cause i think thats incompatible to the wolf-files...
i dont know the format of this files...thats rippers part...but maybee we can write a compressor for this file like we have do for the sprites...
i dont know...

@wolfman:
okay we can save this settings...should not to be a big problem...

@tricob:
1)okay i try to bring this scrolling-feature to run....
2)yes , its only our own wolf-mods...operation zusammenkunft and internal dont released mods....but in the next verison we have a bigger list and i think SOD2 is too integrated....
but if anything you need , look in the mapobject-folder , you can make your own things , its no problem....
3)yes we work on this button Wink*g*

hehe...a we startet to write ce , ripper has too 800x600....so i have tryed to make this scrolling...but ripper has get a bigger monitor and we forget this feature Wink*g*

@all:
okay thanks for all the good feedback...that motivating...

andi
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 6:17 pm
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Yawn Yawn Yawn Yawn
I've got go to bed... but first I want to announce, that we just released ChaosEdit preRelease v1.1.
Though I just already noticed, that SOD2 is still missing (Andi just said, he's going to add it in the next version) and that I'm not sure about the option saving WolfMan requested, there IS enough to be worth downloading it Wink
Have a look at the preRelease page to see most changes (some minor bugfixes aren't mentioned there, as it would have taken more time to write it down than fix them. And by the way nobody noticed anyways... Although this only shows, that nobody uses CE... Crying or Very sad)
For example the "Load all" feature including a "Compress all" is now available. And the scrollbars are working, though a sensible design for 800x600 is still needed, as those scrollbars aren't that nice to work with...

So, enjoy! *fallingintobed*
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 7:21 pm
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Excellent! Thanks for the news, Ripper. I'm downloading this one ASAP. (Opens new window to download, so he can download it while finishing up message board replies)
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 7:44 pm
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Subject: Wall texture editor

Would you be interested in having the editor include a "generate textures" option, where every pixel that's one particular color (255, if the user selects it) would automatically be given a texture the utility generates? I can supply information on the algorithms that the utility would use (They're quite simple; no geometry involved). I have two "Rock" pattern algorithms (among others), and can even E-Mail examples of what the algorithm can create.

I have the algorithms running in my own DOS-based program, but the utility's far from complete (I hope to get back on it later this week).
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 9:06 am
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Hm, sounds interesting. Could you send us some examples?
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:32 am
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ChaosTeam,

Nice work! The load all/compress all feature is very handy and easy to use. I like that you can navigate to the game's folder too! It's all I aksed for and more!

Just a little nit, though; the VGAGRAPH file always gets bigger when I use this feature, usually by about 550 - 650 bytes. I don't think that the graphics part is the problem, since I used to load just that and get a very slight reduction when saving. I think one of the following parts gets expanded: fonts, screens, tile8s.

@Ripper: people use CE! I see evidence that at least 10 of the released mods have CE's distinctive footprint on them:

Resident Evil (both)
Schabbs 3000
Spear of Dreams (regular and SE)
The Grail of Eternal Life
The Rise of Jason
The Untold Story
Project Wolfgeist
Operation Recover Spear

And I use it too! Mr Green

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 3:52 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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Am I the only one who gets can't allocate memory 13 error when saving sprites? It seems to happen only when I save sprites. I won't even need to import a new sprite for this to happen.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 9:21 am
   Subject: Re: ChaosEdit preRelease released ;D
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@andy:really so many mods use ce ? hey ! Smile

@megabyte:yes it looks like.....
give us more infos , which windows-version ? which chaosedit-version ? which cpu ? ! how many ram ! ?

but i cant find error 13 in our actual source-code....please download first the newest version of ce an try again....

andi


p.s.:i must still write a couple of words to a new feature in the new version that im really happy to have this....
ChaosEdit can now load Gamemaps and Maptemp-files without any Maphead-file....
that helps not only to load corridor7-levels without the exe , it helps to reconstruate mapfiles with corrupted or lost maphead-files !
i dont think im the only one that has killed his mapheads and lost levels in this way....
Chris
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 10:08 am
   Subject: Agent 86 and 99 battling Kaos
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Everything looks pretty cool. I like some of the enhancements like being able to blend pictures into 128x128 and back, and being able to open maps without the maphead (when my sister and I made our first map in 1996, which I can still remember vividly, we accidently wrote over the maphead file, and I only kept the gamemaps file for awhile before deciding it was hopeless; but I've been regretting deleting it ever since).

Two things in 3dEdit:

- I think the floor color should always be defaulted to black when floorcodes are on; so that doors and outer edge of some walls will look right. Or maybe you can assign the floorcode of the square N/W of the door under the door (like I think it does on wolf3d; which Adam explained here).

- Some sprites aren't visible in both pre-release V1.0 and V1.1. For example, check out the bottom row at (4,61) in E6L5, and the entire bottom hallway in E6L8 (if you use Death Incarnate, that actors won't be visible there either). I'm guessing it's because there is some kind of limit to how many can be drawn on the map?

What I meant before by having floorcodes on 3dEdit was actually being able to select them and use them in 3dEdit; which doesn't seem possible unless I trick the program into thinking a wall is a floorcode - haha. But whatever, still looks cool with the floors on the 3d map (even though they're already in the display at the bottom). I'm curious about the audio, are you planning on adding a section for adlib/pc sounds? If it exists already, I couldn't find it.
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